Bruceville/Laguna Intersections - camera
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1
January 19, 2012 6:05:57 PM PST
I happened to hear that this intersection is being referred to as "the million $ intersection". Have no idea how that comment came to be or where a person may have acquired the info - true or not - it does, though, prompt me to wonder how much revenue has been brought in with all the cameras throughout our city and where that $ is then expended.
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2
January 19, 2012 7:39:20 PM PST
I still don't like those damn things. If a real police officer didn't see it it shouldn't count. Sure they claim the pictures are reviewed by a real officer but I don't believe it, I have hard proof that the toll ones for fasttrack violations aren't always reviewed.
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3
January 20, 2012 6:23:08 AM PST
I know the answer as I lived it!
This intersection was making big revenues as many were in california not so much due to red light runners but for "California, Hollywood stop" violations that were bringing in the money. I was headed north on Bruceville and turned east on Laguna. The light was red and I rolled through the intersection. Then about a month later got the ticket in the mail. Now just to mention by definition I did run a red light! absolutly I did. But, the cameras were instaled not to make big revenues but to catch the people that run red light that eccelerate and try to beat the red light and cause high speed collision in doing so. They have helped stop this type of action. This rolling stop cost me 560.00 by the time I was done with court cost and traffice school. Just after I paid for the ticket Arnold approved a bill that seperates this type of violation and now the fines are two different fees. The cameras were not put in to make big revenues but to stop the possibility of collisions and they have helped in doing so. And to mention the cost of operating these cameras it very costly and minimal fees come to our comunity. It is not done at our city offices but by an outside source we hire to install and maintain these cameras.
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4
January 20, 2012 7:59:29 AM PST
I've always heard the cameras on Franklin and Laguna were the worst. I think many drivers were cited when turning right onto Laguna when driving south on Franklin so people started cutting through the Walgreens parking lot. I do wonder how much longer these will be used since Los Angeles stopped using them, I believe.
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5
January 20, 2012 9:56:06 AM PST
I am surprsed how many stupid people still talk on phone when at this intersection, that is really stupid.
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6
January 20, 2012 10:57:48 AM PST
When turning right on a red in Elk Grove at an intersection with a camera...I'm told that if you stop before the white line - wait 3 to 5 seconds -- then scooch out and make the turn safely, you'll be all good.
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7
January 20, 2012 11:06:36 AM PST
We need one of those cameras at East Elk Grove Post Office.
It's very rare for drivers to stop at all, even though there is a definite STOP sign before reaching the sidewalk.
Most drivers just zip out, turning right and never checking the sidewalk to the left.
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8
January 20, 2012 11:29:55 AM PST
The other morning at approximately 8:30am or so I was driving South on Bruceville from Laguna. I came up to Soaring Oaks where the school is. The traffic turning on to Soaring Oaks going to the school was horrible but every time the light cycled to turn onto Soaring Oaks I counted at least 3 cars run the red light to get to the school. That's where EGPD needs to sit in the morning. I always wonder where they all hide in the morning because I rarely see ANY units around that time.
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9
January 21, 2012 6:41:12 AM PST
Concerned residents may want to start obeying the traffic laws at all times, then there would be no worries at photo enforced intersections or any other time.
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10
January 22, 2012 8:33:50 AM PST
When you are behind me at this intersection, do not lean on your horn. I will NOT turn until the light is green. These cameras malfunction and are being taken out of many cities. I will not put up with having to go to court for something I did not do and have to prove!
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11
January 22, 2012 11:48:47 AM PST
Here's a noble idea. Why not just follow the law?
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12
January 22, 2012 12:09:45 PM PST
Sounds like the cameras are doing their job...
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13
January 22, 2012 1:13:36 PM PST
I also got one of those "California Stop" tickets at the light on Bruceville and Laguna a couple of years ago now and very expensive. It has taught me to STOP at the lights and stop signs, no rolling through.
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14
January 22, 2012 1:14:49 PM PST
Ah, the perfect example of Noblesse Oblige! Privilege entails responsibility. Remember the movie Liar Liar? 'I've got some advice for you. Stop breaking the law!'
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15
January 22, 2012 1:57:53 PM PST
Speaking of the white line, I have tried to research the history behind the pedestrian line at crosswalks, i.e., where in the law, when was it put into the law, when it went into law how was the public notified/educated, etc. Does anyone know? It seems to me they just appeared and many people don't even know what a pedestrian line is.
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16
January 22, 2012 2:36:29 PM PST
This is a good question. Perhaps it has to do with the camera intersections? Seems about the same time these lines appeared?
LIMIT LINE….
Right turn against a red light–Signal and stop for a red traffic light at the marked limit line. If there is no limit line, stop before entering the crosswalk. If there is no crosswalk, stop before entering the intersection. You may turn right if there is no sign to prohibit the turn. Yield to pedestrians, motorcyclists, bicyclists, or other vehicles moving on their green light.
Then there’s this:
(c) Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a local authority may adopt rules and regulations by ordinance or resolution providing for the placement of a stop sign at any location on a highway under its jurisdiction where the stop sign would enhance traffic safety.
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17
January 22, 2012 4:42:07 PM PST
I have seen cases where a driver properly stopped and went to go and another vehicle came up from behind too fast triggering the light. In fact there is one in the County at Florin and East Parkway that you can trigger almost everytime without a violation.
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18
January 22, 2012 5:54:26 PM PST
@Rob~HUH? You mean triggered a red light? Green light? Yellow light? Excuse my ignorance, trying to comprehend.
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19
January 22, 2012 8:33:09 PM PST
Triggered the camera
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20
January 22, 2012 9:43:37 PM PST
Rob, you mean the 1st car went too fast triggering a ticket for the second car, right? That happened to my wife. Two court appearances later they dropped the charges.
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21
January 23, 2012 8:26:50 AM PST
My wife was turning left onto EG Blvd the other day from Franklin and the light turned yellow and then red while she was still in the intersection because the traffic in front of her slowed down leaving her in the intersection while the lights changed to red. She entered the intersection when green but she's afraid that she's going to get a ticket because she saw flashes of light from the cameras. Hoping for the best but expecting the worst.
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22
January 23, 2012 8:46:04 AM PST
If your wife entered the intersection before the light turned red then she should not get a ticket.
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23
January 23, 2012 1:31:29 PM PST
Years ago, we finally got stoplights on Laguna Blv. I've been here (Laguna) since 1987. Long time ago and far far away, the left turn lights from Laguna onto Laguna Park was so fast that I literally could not make my turn with the green arrow before a red light appeared.
That sucks about cameras catching the wrong driver. :(
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24
January 23, 2012 3:06:00 PM PST
We reviewed the video on line showing that she clearly stopped. At the first court appearance the traffic prosecutor disagreed and tried to pursuade her to plead guilty. She declined and at the second appearance they dropped the charges due to lack of evidence. I couldn't believe they were so blind and it took two appearances to rectify the citation.
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25
January 23, 2012 5:33:18 PM PST
Of course. They are trying to make money. The courts really don't care whether you are guilty or not.
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26
January 23, 2012 8:57:19 PM PST
The Dude abides!
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27
January 24, 2012 7:24:12 AM PST
Growing up in Southern California, the Limit Lines were at just about every intersection. From what I remember, crossing that line is essentially running the light and endangers pedistrian safety in the crosswalk. When I moved to Sac, there were no Limit Lines. Kind of glad to see them in use.
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28
January 24, 2012 10:07:09 AM PST
"...The courts really don't care whether you are guilty or not".
C'mon Rob...I realize there are periodic miscarriages of justice, and those are unfortunate, but a blanket statement like that just isn't true. There are many conscientious judges, court clerks, and police officers who have made a committment and career and are sworn to uphold the law....and Im sure they would not appreciate being thrown into a generalized statement like that. When you say "the courts", you inlcude the entire criminal justice system....or are you singling out the judges, or the prosecutors, or the officer who reviewed the camera tape? Are you saying they don't care if you're guilty or innocent? Some may agree that the cameras are a revenue generating device....but they've also cut down on red light runners and accidents. No one likes getting busted by a camera, or having to fork over $400 in these difficult fiscal times, but that shouldn't indict the entire system.
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29
January 24, 2012 10:25:28 AM PST
Sidewalks are my "roads".
Obey the law so, that my "roads" are as safe as yours!
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30
January 24, 2012 10:39:51 AM PST
Someone needs to tell the person who rides the Lark on Whitelock between 2 a.m. and 4 a.m. regularly. It's not a good idea with only that little reflector and their back to traffic. I have 20/17 corrected laser vision and barely saw the lark at 300 feet.
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31
January 24, 2012 11:21:44 AM PST
@ Oceans-my kids gave their Dad a keychain, and I use the same expression: "If you don't like the way I drive, stay off the sidewalk!" It is a JOKE, of course, I've never taken my truck or my CRV off road.
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32
January 24, 2012 11:49:16 AM PST
involvedcitizen   said:
"...The courts really don't care whether you are guilty or not". C'mon Rob...I realize there are periodic miscarriages of justice, and those are unfortunate, but a blanket statement like that just isn't true. There are many conscientious judges, court clerks, and police officers who have made a committment and career and are sworn to uphold the law....and Im sure they would not appreciate being thrown into a generalized statement like that. When you say "the courts", you inlcude the entire criminal justice system....or are you singling out the judges, or the prosecutors, or the officer who reviewed the camera tape? Are you saying they don't care if you're guilty or innocent? Some may agree that the cameras are a revenue generating device....but they've also cut down on red light runners and accidents. No one likes getting busted by a camera, or having to fork over $400 in these difficult fiscal times, but that shouldn't indict the entire system.
There's a reason why cities around the country are abandoning their camera systems. There are even reports of INCREASED rear end accidents at certain intersections due to people slamming on their brakes from driving too fast to try and avoid a red light ticket. I agree that with the limited resources the departments have I would rather have our officers handling other things then something as petty as traffic but that is why we have traffic units (motor units, etc.). There is a LOT of injustices in the traffic court system. I know someone who received a ticket from CHP for driving 45 in a 35, the posted speed limit was indeed 45MPH and the person took photos and video of the speed limit sign where they received the ticket. Then in court the judge REFUSED to see the photos or video and the officer said, "well she was actually driving 55 in a 35 but I wrote 45 on the ticket to give her a break.".. Basically lying on a ticket. Another court cluster, there is a person sitting in the main jail at this very moment who has been in there since August on a false accusation, no evidence, only hearsay, did NOT waive his right to a speedy trial and it is documented that he did not waive the rights yet they have not set a trial until March. Really? That is a clear violation of his consitutional rights of a right to a speedy trial. Ok I'm quite off topic so I will stop before I keep rattling on. LOL I do agree that people should not run red lights and should pay if they do however the cameras are too much.
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33
January 24, 2012 12:03:26 PM PST
Rob916, I have a question. If law enforcement stops using the cameras, what do you recommend they do to deter these kinds of intersection law breakers?
I see sooooo many red light runs and non-stops at intersections turning right. I have seen as many as four people run red lights. In the meantime, my pedestrian light only has a few seconds to run and a short window for me to cross.
Help us, please. We are so vulnerable. At this point, our only option is to wait until the next light cycles around again.
I just wish cameras could catch texters, too. Those inconsiderate law breakers threaten my life every day! They flat out do not see me.
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34
January 24, 2012 12:47:56 PM PST
Off topic, but I believe last year a female jogger was killed at Laguna park Drive, near Taco Bell) because a driver ran through a red light? what happend to the driver?
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35
January 24, 2012 1:19:53 PM PST
I believe that folks are confusing REVENUE with PUNISHMENT. The three branches of government are executive, legislative and judicial. For this discussion-legislative is what/who makes the laws, executive enforces the laws, and judicial hears disputes and determine punishment. They are separate, equal in their responsibilities, and together comprise the entirety of government.
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36
January 28, 2012 10:50:05 PM PST
Thr4iamPaul said:
My wife was turning left onto EG Blvd the other day from Franklin and the light turned yellow and then red while she was still in the intersection because the traffic in front of her slowed down leaving her in the intersection while the lights changed to red. She entered the intersection when green but she's afraid that she's going to get a ticket because she saw flashes of light from the cameras. Hoping for the best but expecting the worst.
I wasn't aware there were any cameras installed at that intersection. I will have to check that out next time I pass through.
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37
January 29, 2012 8:27:21 AM PST
A green light doesn't mean you have the right to enter the intersection if traffic isn't moving. I see this in downtown Sacramento all the time, people drive into the intersection even though traffic is stopped, because they don't want to have to wait for the signal to cycle through again. So they sit there until the cars in front of them move, always blocking cross traffic who now has the green light, and often blocking the crosswalk to pedestrians.
Just having a green light doesn't always mean you should enter an intersection. Look a few meters beyond the front of your car and see what's going on ahead.
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38
January 29, 2012 2:47:50 PM PST
@MaryMargaret-excellent point. The 'entitled' attitude is demonstrated again. I was with an acquaintance who crossed into a crosswalk on the opposite side of the street. He became enraged at the elderly woman who was trying to cross and whose walker scraped my acquaintance's bumper. I told him he had NO BUSINESS straddling the crosswalk that way and it was HIS fault!
That went over like a lead balloon!
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39
January 29, 2012 5:28:18 PM PST
Some jurisdictions will cite you for "gridlock" where you enter an intersection on a green light knowing that the traffic is backed up into the intersection and there's not way it's going to clear when the light changes. That effectively blocks the traffic coming from the sides. You have to leave the interesection clear and if it looks like you're goig to be stuck in the middle, you have to wait for another light cycle.
Rob: So much of your informatin is second hand or hearsay...which doesn't give it the credibiity it needs to become "fact". Where are the statistics for some of your statements about rear enders because of the cameras? There's too much speculaton on this forum sometimes, which doesn't really address what actually happened. Additionally, there are cops (especially CHP) who will reduce the mph clocked on a ticket and write it for under what the person was actually clocked at in order to "give them a break"...but it also serves to make the person feel that they did in fact get a break and not contest it in court where the officer gets tied up for the day. Most folks are thankful for getting written less than what they were actually driving,...in some cases if you're over the limit by 20mph it can result in a more serious fine ro reflect on your insurance. I wouldn't always look a gift horse in the mouth.
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40
January 30, 2012 12:27:57 PM PST
@involved-this idiot I mention was crossing from a stop sign at a two way controlled intersection that traversed a one way street with no controls. This elderly woman was also leading a dog on a leash. All this was clearly visible from the approach. How I wish he'd been cited-I sure "cited" him!
@Rob-your picture looks like a maniac waving a gun! Be afraid, be very afraid!
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