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1
January 13, 2012 11:37:03 AM PST
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2
January 13, 2012 11:37:19 AM PST
oops. "won"
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3
January 13, 2012 3:57:31 PM PST
Yes, who "one"!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would like to know too.
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4
January 14, 2012 9:33:19 AM PST
Allison and Ron won, congrats to both of them...
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5
January 14, 2012 9:50:39 AM PST
Allison Aleman and Ron SooHoo were elected. Each received over 1,000 votes compared to about 100 each for the other 3 candidates. Pretty lopsided. Evidently, by coincidence (?), Allison and Ron were the 2 candidates who, along with 3 apparant supporters, went out in the community and collected proxies from owners who had not yet voted. These proxies allowed the candidates to vote for themselves if they chose to. Perhaps they would have been elected without the proxies but one has to wonder why owners would willingly give there proxies directly to candidates who can vote for themselves or others who can then vote for their favorite, rather that cast their own votes.
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6
January 14, 2012 10:18:17 AM PST
Here's my concern. It appears that many times the desires to be on the board and/or being involved in Stonelake community politics is motivated not by a sense of community, but by which rules that person opposes. Some people hate the parking rules. Some people hate the garage use rules. Some people hate the yard maintenance rules. Well, I'm seeking a candidate that opposed restrictions on what colors are allowed when painting my house. I would like to paint my house orange with pink trim. I should be able to do that as it's my property and no one can tell me what color my house should be. If anyone will run on that agenda, please let me know. You've got my proxy.
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7
January 14, 2012 5:11:49 PM PST
fuggedaboudit, do you have any figures of how many votes were cast for Allison or Ron through Proxy and how many were cast normally. if your inference is true then this is concerning, if it is not and they won regardless of the proxys then this proxy concern is just stirring the pot of what should be a good thing that so many people voted finally..
as we all know past election turnouts have been embarrassing with us never meeting quorum.
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8
January 14, 2012 5:13:43 PM PST
I also think that even if a ridiculously large percentage of their votes came from Proxies, lets say 50% they still would have won with 500 votes each..
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9
January 14, 2012 6:19:42 PM PST
Birddog: There are no numbers yet that I know of and they may still have won without the proxies. There should be a report by "The Ballot Box" at some point. The ballots that were cast by the proxyholders are secret. However the concern is that candidates are allowed to go out and collect proxies from owners and vote for themselves. Doesn't that raise any concern on your part? If so few owners vote themselves and just give their proxies to others then I don't think it is a fair representation of who the community wants. But it is what it is and if owners are too busy to vote themselves or just don't care, then I just hope these 2 candidates govern with the best intererts of the community and not based on whatever agenda they may have. In any given future election, whoever collects the most proxies will have a decided edge over the others. I just don't think that's a good way to run and election.
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10
January 14, 2012 7:51:17 PM PST
You know, at first it concerned me that campaigning delegates (and supporters) went out and gathered proxies from home owners. But think about it. The community is generally apathetic about what happens with Stonelake community governance. Maybe this is the new way to run an election. Afterall, most times elections take place the quorum for being able to even count votes is not met. And not by just a little but by quite a large number of community members not participating. The quorum is - in accordance with election rules - reduced and the vote is taken again. If we utilize this new election process, elections in Stonelake can become a competition of the candidates whereby they go to as many homes as possible (before the others) and collect proxies. If home owners are informed (or even care) about who is running/elected, they can chose to give their proxy to the first person to show up or save it for someone specific. At least the election process could be streamlined with this methodology. And - correct me if I'm wrong - we wouldn't even need to amend the rules! Or do community members really want a say on what happens in Stonelake?
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11
January 14, 2012 11:20:07 PM PST
fuggedaboudit, the proxy situation baffles me more than it scares me. As polarizing as the last few issues that the board tried to tackle have been it seemed that most of the homeowners had a very strong opinion one way or the other. The Proxy process takes someone explaining what the proxy process is and then they have to sign something so your probably spending more time doing that then just voting for someone and sending it in.
So with these two things in mind it doesn't make sense (if you are correct) that a large portion of homeowners decided to sign over their right to vote to a proxy. Not that it is not possible, it just doesn't logically seem likely.
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12
January 15, 2012 8:55:04 AM PST
It is my understanding that proxies can also count towards meeting the quorum as long as they are signed by the homeowner...there does not have to be a vote on them. Numbers of proxies does have to be announced...I believe from the above posts that you are treading in dangereous territory, it just takes one homeowner to challenge the process and it could become a redo. JMO and invite someones legal opinion. Something just doesn't sound right about this process.
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13
January 15, 2012 10:30:19 AM PST
It was a lawyer who organized the proxy issue and a former delegate, so it is legal, leave it to a lawyer to find a loophole. And Allison Aleman is a lawyer herself. There were 115 proxies turned in at the meeting. I don't care much for any of this but it was done legally although a bit under handed as you had to read the bylaws to even know about this. I personally am familiar with the CC&R's but who would have known about the bylaws and loopholes. I'm not at all happy about how this all turned out but it was all done above board. :(:(:(:(
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14
January 15, 2012 6:26:32 PM PST
Pinkprincess, if your count of 115 proxies is correct then we can assume that each proxy was used for both of its votes and therefore worth 230 votes.
if we removed (disqualified) every vote brought in by proxy then from the counts i saw posted, Allison and Ron still would have won by a landslide. So all of these concerns brought up on this thread are moot points.
no matter what we would have done about these proxies the end result would still be the same Allison and Ron still would have won. and won by a large margin.
If people are still concerned about proxies then a new discussion should be started concerning future elections. but as far as referring to this election the proxy's had no effect on the outcome, and are therefore a dead issue.
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15
January 15, 2012 8:38:51 PM PST
If the #'s in post 5 are correct, that's a pretty good voter "turnout". Over 2300 responses, proxy or otherwise. Isn't each house afforded 2 votes, so about 2900 for all of Stonelake?
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16
January 16, 2012 12:13:19 AM PST
My count is correct, I was there at the meeting when it was announced, so yes, it does appear that Allison and Ron won by a landslide. Perhaps they went door to door to solicit votes for themselves. If so, then they really must have wanted the positions that they were voted in at. All's fair in love and elections :):):)
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17
January 16, 2012 9:02:37 AM PST
Hi- I don't usually comment on here but I felt it fair to Ron that I do. I am one of the people who signed a proxy vote for him. He came to my door and sat in my front yard and talked for 20 min about our community and things going on in schools, etc. I like him and his commitment to community both during his years in his career and as a parent in after school activities and wanting to make Stonelake a great place to live. I respect his time and effort to get out and meet the neighbors and ask for a vote. FYI I prob would not have voted or gotten involved because of the very energy in this forum. I find more people willing to complain than support. I love my home and community and want the best for all of us but for me it's about safety, good concerned neighbors, spirit during holidays, good school support, etc. not about parking and what's in my garage. I say Contrats to our winners and lets all get behind them and support them and make Stonelake the perfect place to raise our kids.
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18
January 17, 2012 2:25:50 PM PST
If the number of proxies stated by PinkPrincess is correct then it would appear that they would have won regardless and will give them my support. However I think that for future elections it would be fair to discuss the use of proxies and how they are solicited from owners. Personally, JustSaying, I would like to see the CC&Rs changed to do away with proxies and the quorum requirement and let owners directly determine the outcome of elections. I'm glad to see njheff's post that Ron was out to talk to neighbors about the issues and solicit his vote rather than just collect his proxie. I am hopeful that the others inlcuding Allison did the same. I will remain skeptical however not knowing what was said to the other 114 owners by the others. I am not accusing anyone of doing anything unethical but because of what has occurred in this community surrounding several contentious issues, especially parkingI will remain skeptical.
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19
January 20, 2012 4:19:46 PM PST
Congrats to the new board.
Are you saying that proxies are somehow not democratic? Are you challenging this acceptable manner of voting? I happily signed the proxy.
What I find more disturbing are rogue neighbors pretending to have HOA authority before Planning Commission meetings when they don't. Filing misleading or false complaints is a very serious issue.
This silent neighbor is now fully awake and will not allow zealots with un-checked power speak on my behalf again! I have a dozens of others closely watching moving forward.
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20
January 20, 2012 10:34:46 PM PST
Oh bobbie - tell us more. Don't know what you're referring to but sure would like to. Do you know something we should know?
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21
January 21, 2012 9:28:20 AM PST
I will provide the minutes from HOA and Planning Commission and let you connect the dots.
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22
January 21, 2012 11:14:07 AM PST
Been thinking - I think of proxies as more useful to cast a vote if I'm a shareholder in a publicly held business and the like. And I guess once a governmental representative is elected, there is an implied proxy. But I don't proxy my vote in determining that representative. Not sure if it even really matters in this case - it's just a homeowners association. And I guess the difference between a zealot and an advocate is a matter of perspective based on what side of the issue you're on.
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23
January 21, 2012 11:43:50 AM PST
I was at the planning commission meeting mentioned in the post by Bobbie. I spoke out against what appears to be a fraudulent letter allegedly from OUR HOA. The quality and authenticty of that letter was also questioned by the Planning Commission. Furthermore in looking at the minutes from the November 19 HOA meeting there is no mention of opposing or asking for restrictions on the application by the local business. But somehow at the follow up planning commission meeting in late November there is a leeter from our HOA management company opposing a local business. Uhmm. How can a letter be sent to the planning commission from the HOA without the approval in the minutes of the BOD of the Stonelake HOA? By violating the Open meetings rules is the only way. If I was on the BOD at that time I would distance myself from this issue and the person driving it as much as possible.
I am glad to see that we now have a retired peace officer and Rotarian on the BOD. Maybe they can apply the Rotary Four Way Test -
1) Is it the Truth
2) Is it FAIR to all concerned
3)Will it build GOOD WILL and BETTER FREINDSHIPS
4) Will it be BENEFICIAL to all concerned
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24
January 21, 2012 11:45:19 AM PST
When someone makes up facts, submits false documents to promote a singlular view point, I do not consider the act advocacy. I do not appreciate when someone makes up stuff to advance their agenda. This is a zealot.
I really don't care what side anyone is on a given issue, just back it up with facts and truthful statements.
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25
January 22, 2012 9:56:17 AM PST
I thought this topic was about who won the board positions. Why has it become a soapbox?
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26
January 22, 2012 10:07:07 AM PST
Asking for accountability of actions taken by board members or persons acting in their behalf is not a soapbox. It is making sure that the new board is aware and informed of potential liability issues surrounding the board and therefore the homeowners.
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27
January 22, 2012 10:18:41 AM PST
Well apparently, we are all sheep, and without you and bobby telling everyone what to think, we wouldn't know what to do.
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28
January 22, 2012 11:04:38 AM PST
Wow Saratoga, hit a nerve? Who's telling who what to think? Hmm. I suppose I will join under many pseudo names on EGO to rock the boat. LOL
How about some transparency..
This is about who won the board positions. It took a wakeup call from many citizens like myself to get more accountability on the board. The action(s) by a single individual led to my support. The two are inter-related for me.
I certainly don't need you to be my lobbyist. Ic an speak for myself as myself.
Have a blessed day- Go Niners :-)
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29
January 22, 2012 11:08:52 AM PST
In the immortal words of Joe Friday “Just the facts Ma'am”. I am not telling anyone what to do or think. I just want to know what the facts are surrounding documents that allegedly came from our HOA and were presented to our local city government. I only want this done to reestablish the HOA's creditability with our local government. If you believe that our HOA has any creditability with the local government watch the December 15th, 2011 Planning Commission meeting where the first fraudulent letter was discussed and the second now apparently questionable letter from the HOA was dismissed by the planning commission. Oh, and by the way I don't hide behind a screen name.
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30
January 24, 2012 11:34:03 AM PST
Bobbie: Regarding your post #19 "Are you saying that proxies are somehow not democratic? Are you challenging this acceptable manner of voting? I happily signed the proxy."
No, I'm not saying that the proxies were undemocratic but I am questioning how they may have been collected or may be collected in the future. No one has ever, to my knowledge, collected proxies in this community for an election. There have been times years ago that homeowners have gone out to try to collect ballots due to lack of quorum, but not proxies. I am concerned about the potential for abuse. Unless the prospective proxieholder fully explains to the owner the process before signing the proxie and has him/her complete voting instructions, then there is the potential for abuse of this valid rule. In regard to your comment regarding zealots, I agree that we should not let people like this speak on our behalf. I am referring to the "zealots" who shouted down the board and other owners who did not agree with them regarding the parking debates; basically took over the parking committee in pursuit of their own rules; and, worse of all, one of them even harrassed Stonelake neighbors who spoke their own opinions regarding the whole mess. It is some of these same people who were out collecting the proxies so they lack credibility with me. So, yes, let's make sure that no zealots can speak for the rest of us. That being said, the new board members were duly elected and I will support them as long as they use their positions for the betterment of our community and not to advance their own agendas. And that is my last comment on this subject.
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31
January 27, 2012 7:46:10 AM PST
Thanks for the clarification fuggedaboudit.
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32
January 27, 2012 4:43:22 PM PST
Sounds like sour grapes to me, fuggedaboutit! Looks like your candidate didn't win. I signed a proxy and knew exactly who I was voting for, and they won. I was impressed that the candidate was out talking with me about the neighborhood. Be a grown up and respectful to the two people that were elected by a landslide. It's posts like yours that drive good people from wanting to serve their neighborhood. Your concerns seem to be your own paranoia or conspiracy theory about someone maybe having done something bad at some time, maybe, or maybe not, or maybe they'll do something bad in the future. Look, if 100 people signed proxies and were mislead, wouldn't you see someone posting about their bad experience?
I've got an idea for you. If you think your neighbors will just sign anything presented to us, perhaps you have a promising career in door to door sales for Kirby Vacuum Company! Good luck with that!
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33
January 28, 2012 4:18:05 PM PST
Wow MarjoityRules...really? You felt it necessary to turn to a personal attack to make a point? It's posts like yours on sites like this that disappoint me because they move away from the issue and become personal. I don't see where fuggedaboutit was disrespectful to anyone; but rather was questioning the process.
I've got an idea for you...next time you might post, you don't have to be so nasty to be heard.
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